In this episode of Bounce, hosts Mollie Cox and Claire Flowers interview Laura Baker, a global design leader. The conversation covers Laura's career journey from industrial design to leading design teams and agencies. The discussion provides insights into Laura's personal experiences, challenges faced in leadership roles, and her views on collaboration between different roles and the future of the design field.

Key topics discussed include:

- Laura's transition from industrial design to UX and service design roles

- Her experience being unexpectedly thrust into a leadership position and navigating imposter syndrome

- Her perspective on what design leadership means, focusing on building trust with her team

- The relationship and dynamics between product management and design roles

- Advice for designers looking to move into leadership positions

- The potential impact of AI on the design industry and whether it could replace human designers

- How the design landscape may evolve in the coming years

Show notes

Here is a summary of the transcript divided into chapters with timestamps:

(01:01) - Guest Introduction

- Hosts Mollie Cox and Claire Flowers introduce the podcast and guest Laura Baker, a global design leader.

(01:44) - Laura's Career Journey

- Laura discusses her transition from industrial design to UX and service design roles.

- She shares how she unexpectedly ended up in a leadership position.

(04:11) - Navigating Imposter Syndrome

- Laura talks about dealing with imposter syndrome when thrust into leadership.

- She discusses her approach to overcoming self-doubt and breaking down challenges.

(10:10) - Design Leadership

- Laura explains what design leadership means to her, emphasizing building trust with her team.

- She shares how she navigates situations where her young age may cause others to question her authority.

(17:00) - Check Your Ego at the Door

- The discussion explores the relationship between product management and design roles.

- Laura provides her perspective on finding the right balance and shared understanding.

(29:29) - Advice for Transitioning to Leadership

- Laura offers advice for designers looking to move into leadership positions.

- She stresses the importance of doing it for the right reasons and being prepared for a significant mindset shift.

(35:07) - The Impact of AI on Design

- The conversation covers the potential impact of AI on the design industry.

- Laura shares her views on whether AI could feasibly replace human designers.

(43:43) - The Future of Design

- Laura discusses how the design landscape may evolve in the coming years.

- She explores the possibility of more strategic roles for designers as AI handles tactical execution.

This episode features a discussion with Trevor Nielsen, a digital product designer. The conversation covers Trevor's career journey, how he transitioned from graphic design to product design, the differences between working at startups versus larger corporations, the risks and challenges associated with the startup world, and his recent experience of being laid off from a crypto startup.

Trevor shares insights on the importance of being open to new opportunities, the value of freelancing, and the potential benefits of having multiple income streams.

(01:11) - Breaking into Product Design

- Trevor shares his journey of transitioning from graphic design to product design, initially through a job opportunity within the same organization.

- He discusses the importance of being open to new opportunities and stepping out of one's comfort zone.

(04:13) - Startups vs. Large Company working dynamics

- Trevor compares his experiences working at startups versus larger corporations, highlighting the differences in team dynamics, processes, and the level of hands-on work.

(10:08) - Risks and Challenges in the Startup World

- The conversation shifts to the risks associated with the startup world, including the potential for failure and the importance of having a safety net or multiple income streams.

- Trevor shares his experience of being laid off from a crypto startup and the resilience required to navigate such situations.

(18:15) - Freelancing and Multiple Income Streams

- Trevor discusses his transition to freelancing and the benefits of having multiple income streams, including increased financial stability and the ability to bet on oneself.

- He shares insights on finding the right balance between the number of clients and maintaining quality work.

(29:37) - Celebrating Revenue Metrics and Supporting Others

- The hosts and Trevor discuss the trend of celebrating revenue metrics in the freelance community and the potential downsides of excessive self-promotion.

- They emphasize the importance of supporting others in the design community and sharing work with context.

(34:06) - Stop, Start, Continue

- Trevor shares his perspective on the 'start, stop, continue' framework, suggesting what practices the freelance community should start, stop, and continue.

In this episode of Bounce, we discuss the role of product marketing teams and the challenges they face. The hosts, Molly Cox and Claire Flowers, interview Olivia McNaughton, Senior Director of Product Marketing at Grinn, about her experience working in product marketing.

Olivia explains that product marketing acts as a go-to-market specialist, supporting the product, sales, and customer success teams. Their primary responsibilities include launching products into the market and funneling market information back to the product team. She highlights the importance of aligning with different teams, communicating effectively, and showcasing the value of product marketing within an organization.

The discussion covers various topics, such as defining the roles and responsibilities of product marketing, potential friction points with product managers and designers, strategies for proving the value of product marketing, and the challenges of coordinating successful product launches. Olivia shares her insights and best practices based on her extensive experience in the field.

Episode Details

(1:30) - Guest Introduction

(3:00) - Defining Product Marketing

(6:00) - Challenges in Product Marketing

(12:00) - Proving Value as a Product Marketer

(18:00) - Collaboration with Product Managers and Designers

(24:00) - Product Launch Processes

(28:00) - Biggest Stressors in Product Launches

(30:00) - Stop Doing This: Requests from a Product Marketer

In this episode, Mollie and Claire interview Rachel Lindsay, an experienced tech recruiter. The discussion covers various aspects of the current tech job market, the role of recruiters in the hiring process, how they evaluate candidates, and advice for job seekers as they navigate their job search.

Show Notes

(02:50) - Rachel's Background in Tech Recruiting

(05:46) - Current Tech Job Market Landscape

- Increased competitiveness in tech recruiting

- Challenges in finding candidates with specific expertise

(08:11) - Recruiting Process and Challenges

- Importance of understanding roles being recruited for

- Balancing candidate volume with specific requirements

- Role of referrals in the hiring process

(15:47) - Entry-Level Hiring and Challenges

- Difficulties for entry-level candidates

- Importance of passion and communication skills

(23:30) - Candidate Behavior and Online Presence

- Impact of candidate attitudes during the hiring process

- Importance of professional online presence

(36:47) - Referrals and Networking

- Significance of referrals in hiring

- Advice on networking and getting referrals

(54:00) - Advice for Job Seekers

- Staying patient during job search

- Continuous learning and skill development

(58:15) - Advice for Companies and Recruiters

- Improving communication in the hiring process

- Streamlining interview processes

An interview with Thom Rimmer, a global design leader with over a decade of experience building industry-leading products and developing a culture of design as a competitive business advantage. The discussion covered:

- Thom's background, including his transition from working at agencies to the world of SaaS.

- His experience at Huddle, a sports tech company, where he worked on globally distributed product teams, managed designers, and helped bring products to coaches and athletes worldwide.

- The challenges of working on a hardware product (a camera) at Huddle, including building a team, overcoming technical hurdles, and convincing stakeholders of the opportunity.

- Thom's decision to leave Huddle at the peak of its success and join Intercom, a B2B customer support SaaS company, to seek new challenges and growth opportunities.

- Insights into building trust and relationships with teams, handling failures and maintaining motivation, and being a leader who protects their team while giving them credit for successes.

Key Moments

(1:11) - Guest Introduction

(2:46) - Globally Distributed Teams at Huddle

(12:21) - Designer Relationships with Product Managers

(18:11) - Leaving Huddle and Joining Intercom

(20:44) - The importance of knowing how to sell your work

(41:00) - If you're not failing then you're not trying hard enough

(47:42) - Advice for Product Managers

Mollie Cox and Claire Flowers take you on a journey through product team fails and flops and the lessons that carry you forward.

In Episode 2 we welcome Joshua Butts, a seasoned product designer, with over nine years of experience in designing native mobile apps and desktop products.

Joshua provides valuable insights into the nuances of failure, the importance of managing expectations, and the practicalities of working in product design. His experiences underscore the complexity of balancing professional demands with personal well-being and the critical role of clear communication and collaboration in achieving success.

Episode Details:

(0:00) - Introduction

(1:02) - Hidden cost of failure

(3:00) - Failure is a privilege

(5:05) - Idealistic advice 

(9:17) - The difference between high and low-cost failure

(11:40) - The solo stove example

(14:50) - Misaligned expectations are a recipe for failure

(18:03) - The importance of working sessions

(20:33) - Experimentation can be a double-edged sword

(28:30) - Evaluating risks and A/B testing

(30:01) - Functionality over aesthetic

(32:30) - MVPs are a trigger word for Josh

(36:40) - Phase 2 of MVPs never happen

(37:45) - Building for the sake of building is a waste of time

(40:06) - Wrap Up - Lessons learned

Welcome to the inaugural episode of "Bounce" with your hosts Claire Flowers and Mollie Cox! 

In this introductory episode, Claire and Mollie delve into the intricate relationship between designers and product managers, uncovering the nuances, challenges, and opportunities within this dynamic collaboration.

Drawing from their own experience on product teams, Claire and Mollie explore the symbiotic and sometimes difficult relationship between designers and product managers.

From where communication can fail and roles can conflict, to where both PMs and designers can improve or adjust. Clarie and Mollie even share their own “friction moments”, failures and “product traumas” as they dissect the messy and oftentimes stressful environments that product teams work in.

Join Claire and Mollie on the beginning of this thought-provoking journey as they unpack the industry – offering invaluable wisdom and actionable advice for professionals navigating this ever-evolving landscape. 

Episode Highlights:

(0:00) - Intro

(0:18) - Exploring the dynamics between product managers and product designers

(1:12) - Discussing the designers first

(4:57) - Designers being more timid

(7:04) - Designers stepping on your toes

(8:42) - Patterns that Mollie is noticing w/ PMs

(10:08) - “We never have time”

(15:18) - Different flavors of PMs

(19:03) - How can designers provide more clarity?

(21:55) - One of Claire’s “friction moments”

(24:03) - Who’s responsible for writing copy?

(29:54) - Mollie’s take on PM boundaries

(34:28) - Bad assumptions

(39:56) - Designers being the “afterthought”

(46:19) - Episode wrap-up

About the Hosts:

Claire Flowers is a Product Manager at Fleetio and brings 10+ years of management experience working with development and design teams.

Mollie Cox a Director of Product Design at Fleetio as well as a Professor at University of Nebraska for over a decade. Her mentorship covers a spectrum of disciplines from UX/UI Design to Portfolio Development, emphasizing design management and laying foundational skills for future designers.

Connect w/ Mollie Cox:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/molliecox/

Connect w/ Claire Flowers:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/claireflowers/

Show notes

Join Mollie and Claire in their discussion with Christopher Nguyen, the founder of UX Playbook. From a computer science dropout to a business graduate, turned self-taught designer, and now a content creator. This episode covers Chris's career journey, including his experiences in toxic work environments, his decision to quit his job during the pandemic, the process of starting and growing UX Playbook, his approach to writing and content creation, and his future plans to evolve his business into coaching designers to build their own businesses. Key discussion points include recognizing signs of an unhealthy work culture, taking ownership of one's career path, the importance of self-reflection, the role of writing and content marketing, and Chris's vision for helping designers become entrepreneurs.

(1:11) - Guest Introduction

The hosts introduce their guest Chris, a product designer, founder of UX Playbook, and former head of design who has worked with companies like Google, Nike, and Coca-Cola. They discuss Chris's background and career journey.

(3:01) - Toxic Work Environments

Chris shares his experience of joining a company that turned out to be toxic, despite being warned beforehand. He describes the red flags, lack of innovation, and the 'good enough' culture that eventually led him to quit.

(12:31) - Taking a Break and Starting UX Playbook

After quitting his toxic job, Chris took some time off to experiment with different projects before accidentally stumbling upon the success of UX Playbook through writing online content.

(19:21) - Knowing When to Leave a Job

The discussion shifts to recognizing signs that it's time to leave a job, such as physical aversion to going to the office, draining interactions, and lack of excitement about the work.

(23:41) - Layoffs and Career Transitions

Chris offers advice for those feeling stuck in their current roles due to the fear of layoffs, emphasizing taking small steps towards exploring new opportunities.

(28:21) - Chris' new venture - The Job Sprint Program

Chris talks about his new program 'The Job Sprint', created to help people land their dream jobs through a tailored approach and active learning activities.

(33:11) - Future Business Evolution

Chris shares his vision for evolving his business beyond just serving designers, potentially helping them build their own businesses and potentially owning a stake in their ventures.

Be sure to check out Chris' latest venture - https://backlog.design/?ref=bounce

Summary

In this episode, Mollie and Claire discuss the emotional toll and challenges of being laid off or fired from a job. They share personal stories about their own experiences of being laid off, the self-doubt and negative thoughts that followed, and the process of finding new jobs. The conversation highlights the importance of maintaining relationships with colleagues, as those connections can lead to future opportunities. They also provide advice on coping strategies, such as taking temporary jobs for financial stability, being positive during the job search, and not beating oneself up over circumstances beyond one's control. This episode aims to offer a candid discussion about the difficulties of job loss and the resilience required to bounce back.

Show notes

(00:53) - Getting Fired or Laid Off

Mollie and Claire discuss the emotional impact of being fired or laid off, sharing their personal experiences and the self-doubt and negative thoughts that followed.

(12:35) - Coping Strategies

They talk about strategies for coping with job loss, such as taking temporary jobs for financial stability, maintaining a positive mindset during the job search, and not beating oneself up over circumstances beyond one's control.

(27:17) - The Importance of Relationships

Mollie and Claire highlight the importance of maintaining relationships with colleagues, as those connections can lead to future opportunities and support during difficult times.

(39:10) - Advice and Reflections

They offer advice on how companies can handle layoffs more empathetically and transparently, and reflect on the lessons learned from their experiences of job loss and the resilience required to bounce back.

Mollie and Claire chat with Jeremy Miller, host of 'Beyond UX Design' podcast and co-founder of Edgecase. The discussion covers Jeremy's career journey from economics student at LSU to UX designer, including his transition through web design, advertising, and eventually UX design. Key topics discussed include the challenges of giving career advice in the current job market, the importance of soft skills and relationships in UX design, and Jeremy's experience with recent layoffs from GE. The conversation also touches on the overemphasis on design tools like Figma in the UX community, the value of taking different career paths to enter UX, and Jeremy's upcoming book about going beyond traditional UX roles.

Show notes

01:08: Introduction of guest Jeremy Miller and his background

02:26: Jeremy's early career story and transition into design

10:12: Discussion about career advice and job market changes

15:09: Conversation about critical thinking and career expectations

30:00: Discussion about team dynamics and roles in software development

42:00: Conversation about tools (particularly Figma) and their role in UX design

50:00: Discussion about design tools evolution and security concerns

Description

This episode explores creative leadership techniques that drive outcomes as well as the pitfalls of survivorship bias in building a product. Kelsey Nichols discusses her unconventional path into product management and building a product way of thinking that focuses on failure patterns and how to adapt.

Show Notes

(0:05) - Introduction to the podcast and hosts

(0:57) - Welcome to Kelsey Nichols, CTO at Landing

(1:07) - Kelsey describes her career journey from PE teacher to engineer to product manager and back to engineering

(3:36) - Kelsey talks about her transition from engineering to product management

(8:14) - The benefits of having a diverse background in product development

(9:33) - The event that led Kelsey to focus more on the "why" of product development

(10:57) - Areas where product leaders might miss the mark according to Kelsey's experience on the engineering team

(13:19) - Challenges of integrating a new product team and common friction points

(14:36) - Building a product department from the ground up and how it's similar to building a product

(16:33) - Initial challenges and concerns about the success of the product department at Landing

(17:40) - Why looking at failures can be just as valuable as looking at successes (concept of survivorship bias)

(21:15) - The importance of embracing failure and creating a safe space for experimentation

(23:34) - Kelsey's experience as the longest-standing product leader at Landing (in jest)

(24:29) - The importance of creating a safe space for product development

(25:12) - The reality of failure and success rates in product development

(25:28) - Transitioning from Engineer to Product Leader

(28:34) - The Danger of Saying No in Product Management

(29:03) - Creative Strategies for Handling Feature Requests

(32:18) - Building Relationships with Stakeholders

(34:33) - The Importance of Business and Customer Focus

(36:09) - Problem-Solving as a Core Skill

(36:58) - The Value of Customer Research

(38:21) - Learning from Mistakes

In this episode of Bounce, Mollie Cox and Claire Flowers interview Cori Fain-Forrest, CEO and Founder of Moxi. The discussion centers around Cori's journey from childcare worker to tech entrepreneur, and her creation of Moxi, a membership-based childcare center that combines traditional childcare with modern amenities. Cori shares her experience with the childcare crisis, which led her to create Moxi. She details the challenges of starting the business, including fundraising difficulties, finding suitable locations, and making personal sacrifices. The conversation covers Moxi's innovative approach to childcare, which includes flexible scheduling through an app, co-working spaces, fitness facilities, and other parent-focused amenities. Cori also discusses the technical challenges of developing the app, her approach to user research, and the importance of listening to customer needs. The interview provides insights into the personal and professional challenges of founding a startup while being a new parent.

Show notes

(00:53) - Introduction of guest Cori Fain-Forrest, founder of Moxi

(02:04) - Cori's background and career journey

(03:43) - Explanation of Moxi's business model and services

(04:58) - Cori's experience in economic development and transition to tech

(07:00) - Discussion of career transition and motherhood as catalyst

(09:55) - Personal experience with childcare crisis

(13:52) - Impact of childcare crisis on families

(17:13) - Development of Moxi and personal sacrifices made

(30:00) - Discussion of Moxi's amenities and services

(40:00) - Product development and user research approach

(50:00) - Closing discussion and wrap-up

In this episode of Bounce, hosts Molly Cox and Claire Flowers dive deep into the incredible journey of Erika Flowers, a renowned author, designer, and technologist currently working at NASA. Erika shares her inspiring story of resilience and transformation, from her early days as a web designer in the 90s to becoming a digital service expert. She opens up about her personal journey as a late-in-life transgender woman and the challenges she faced along the way. Join us for an insightful conversation about identity, growth, and the power of being true to yourself.

Show Notes

(00:37) - Introduction

(01:31) - Erika Flowers Career Overview

(07:56) - Journey of Self-Discovery and the Transgender Experience

(17:20) - Masking and Authenticity

(19:00) - Implications of Coming Out at Work

(22:33) - Transitioning and Personal Relationships and Transition

(24:27) - Coping with External Perceptions

(28:24) - Navigating Professional and Personal Identity

(35:28) - Positive Outcomes Post-Transition

(37:13) - Intersection of Identity and Workplace Treatment

(40:21) - Passing and Workplace Misogyny

(41:49) - Importance of Creating a Support Environment for Transgender Individuals

(51:02) - Empathy and Visibility

(53:23) - Being a Good Ally

In the 8th episode of Bounce, co-hosts Mollie Cox and Claire Flowers interview guest Fo Neale-May, a seasoned senior director of Product Operations in B2B SaaS startups. They discuss the core aspects of product operations, including its definition, key responsibilities, strategies for overcoming resistance, and the common challenges faced in the field. The conversation discusses the scaling of product ops, integration with other functions like design ops, and the importance of effective insight utilization and boundary setting. With practical anecdotes and advice, the episode offers a comprehensive understanding of how product operations contribute to the efficiency and success of product teams.00:00 Introduction to Bounce Podcast

00:14 Meet the Hosts: Mollie and Claire

01:04 Introducing Today's Guest: Fo Neale-May

02:06 Defining Product Operations

02:32 The Role and Impact of Product Ops

07:09 Challenges and Resistance in Product Ops

14:38 Boundaries and Responsibilities in Product Ops

17:26 Scaling Product Ops Across Organizations

20:23 Common Themes and Challenges in Product Ops

26:34 The Reality of Design Systems

28:11 Challenges in Product Operations

29:25 Identifying the Right Time for Product Ops

30:53 Organizational Structure of Product Ops

32:37 Misunderstandings and Resistance in Product Ops

35:58 The Importance of Seeking to Understand

38:25 Staying Motivated in a Misunderstood Field

41:38 Hot Buttons in Product Ops

46:01 Gardening and Final Thoughts

In this episode, Mollie and Claire interview Sara Wachter-Boettcher, a leadership coach, speaker, and author who is the CEO of Active Voice, a company focused on creating bold leaders and better workplaces in design and tech. The conversation covers:

• Sara's career journey and transition from consulting to founding Active Voice
• The challenges faced by product teams and designers in balancing their values with business priorities
• The importance of setting boundaries and maintaining a sense of identity beyond one's job
• Fostering psychological safety within teams
• Advice for newcomers entering the tech industry amidst ongoing changes and uncertainties.

(01:08) - Guest Introduction

Sara is introduced as the guest, and her background as a leadership coach, speaker, author, and CEO of Active Voice is highlighted.

(02:17) - Sara's Career Journey

Sara shares her career journey, starting as a web writer, transitioning into content strategy and UX work, building a team at an agency, and eventually moving into consulting.

(04:09) - Founding Active Voice

Sara discusses the motivation behind founding Active Voice, stemming from her observations of people struggling to find their voice and power within organizations.

(06:31) - Work-Life Balance and Identity

The conversation explores the challenges of maintaining a healthy work-life balance, the tendency to wrap one's identity around work, and the importance of separating personal identity from professional roles.

(10:23) - Navigating Gender Biases

Sara shares her experiences navigating gender biases in the workplace, the double standards women face in tech, and strategies for asserting oneself while maintaining authenticity.

(16:33) - Fostering Psychological Safety

The discussion focuses on fostering psychological safety within teams, the role of leaders in creating a safe environment for vulnerability, and the importance of open communication and setting boundaries.

(21:21) - Work Pressures in the Tech Industry

Sara addresses common challenges faced by individuals in the tech industry, such as the pressure to prioritize metrics over human-centered values, the dissonance between personal beliefs and organizational priorities, and the need for self-awareness and boundary-setting.

(28:48) - Sara's Biggest Challenges in the Workplace

Sara reflects on her challenges, including setting boundaries, communicating effectively, and building mutually beneficial working relationships.

(34:47) - Advice for Newcomers to Tech

Sara offers advice for newcomers entering the tech industry, emphasizing the importance of accepting change, maintaining a sense of identity beyond work, and finding ways to express personal values both within and outside of one's job.

The episode features an interview with Shegan Otulana, a successful entrepreneur who came to the US from Nigeria in 1998. The discussion focuses on entrepreneurship, product development, and business resilience. Shegan shares his journey from delivering pizzas during college to selling his company Theranest for $1.25 billion. He now runs Harmony Venture Labs (HVL), a venture studio, and Copysmith AI, a generative AI software company. Throughout the interview, Shegan discusses his approach to evaluating business ideas, the importance of timing in business success, his hiring practices, and provides insights into identifying market opportunities. He emphasizes the significance of curiosity, humility, and continuous learning in entrepreneurship.

Show notes

(00:53) - Guest Introduction

- Introduction of Shegan Otulana

- Background on his journey from Nigeria to Birmingham, Alabama

- His successful $1.25 billion company exit

(02:28) - Early Entrepreneurial Experience

- Discussion of Shegan's early business ventures

- Childhood business experiences in Nigeria

- Philosophy on freedom and entrepreneurship

(05:59) - Early Business Failures and Timing

- Discussion of early product attempts since 2003

- Importance of market timing in business success

- Examples of products that were ahead of their time

(10:22) - Harmony Venture Labs (HVL)

- Overview of HVL's mission and operations

- Discussion of Copysmith AI and other ventures

- Approach to innovation and product development

(13:35) - Idea Evaluation and Business Development

- Criteria for good business ideas

- Discussion of market timing and trends

- Importance of multiple supporting elements for success

(29:27) - Team Building and Hiring

- Discussion of hiring practices

- Important qualities in team members

- Approach to evaluating potential hires

(44:41) - Market Opportunities

- Discussion of underserved markets

- Analysis of generational shifts

- Identification of potential business opportunities

(50:54) - Closing Advice

- Advice for aspiring entrepreneurs

- Importance of relationships

- Final thoughts and podcast wrap-up