Agency Business (Brian Wieser and Olivia Morley)

Kate O’Brien, founder of Powers of Reasoning and former executive at Omnicom Media Group agencies such as Hearts & Science and Resolution Agency, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to discuss evolving compensation models, balancing senior talent with efficiency, and the future of media agency leadership.​

Drawing from her extensive experience leading media strategy for global brands, Kate shares insights into launching her own consultancy and advising clients on media strategy, pricing models, and managing economic uncertainty. The conversation explores the tension between principal-based buying and transparent partnerships, as well as how agencies can deliver value while navigating client demands for efficiency and growth.​

Plus, Olivia, Brian, and Kate talk recent leadership changes at GroupM, trends in agency compensation, and the ongoing debate over performance-based models.

Subscribe to the Agency Business newsletter.

Reach Out

Agency Business works with sponsors, but it’s not pay-to-play. We consider guests who are decision-makers at the highest level of their agencies. We’d love to feature more women and leaders of color—if that's you or someone you know, please reach out:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

This episode is sponsored by Ebiquity.

Picture this: complete confidence that every dollar of your media budget is working as hard as possible.

That's what Ebiquity delivers. They are the world's leading media investment analysts, helping global brands turn media complexity into competitive advantage. Through independent, data-driven analysis, they identify inefficiencies, create transparency, and unlock hidden value in your media investments.

Over 80 of the world's largest advertisers trust Ebiquity for a reason. Visit ebiquity.com today and discover how they can help your brand.

Tim Nollen, a longtime ad industry sell-side analyst at Macquarie Group Ltd. and previously at J.P. Morgan and Bear Stearns, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to discuss the state of agency holding companies, their challenges, and the sustainability of their business models.

Tim explains how financial pressures, shifting client demands, and competition from consulting firms and ad tech companies are forcing holding companies to evolve. He shares insights on media and creative integration, how agencies are adapting to new economic realities, and the potential impact of the Omnicom-IPG merger.

He also reflects on his career analyzing the business of advertising and shares his perspective on where the industry is headed next.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

FirmDecisions, part of Ebiquity Group plc, is the world's largest marketing contract compliance specialist, dedicated to enhancing commercial transparency in client-agency relationships.

With expertise across all agency types—creative, media, influencer, and shopper—FirmDecisions provide comprehensive coverage of a brand's agency portfolio.

Stop wondering if your marketing budget is working as hard as it can. Let FirmDecisions help you strengthen agency relationships, improve governance, and drive better business outcomes.

Learn more at firmdecisions.com.

In this episode of Agency Business, Brian Wieser and Olivia Morley talk with Kamran Asghar, CEO and founder of Crossmedia USA, about the evolving landscape of independent media agencies. Asghar shares insights into Crossmedia’s journey, its commitment to transparency, and how independent agencies can provide an alternative to holding company networks.

Key topics covered in this episode include:

• Crossmedia’s origin story and its mission to provide integrated media solutions outside of the holding company model.
• How Crossmedia’s partnership with Joan Creative is shaping new approaches to collaboration.
• How Asghar thinks about delivering scale, cost efficiencies, and transparency to clients. "There are more integrated remits now than there have been before," he says. "I don't think there are many solutions out there."
• The growing demand for principle-based media buying.
• Asghar’s take on recent industry news, including leadership changes at major holding companies and what it signals for agency culture.

Key Moments:

[1:20] Asghar’s journey from Ogilvy to launching Crossmedia USA.

[5:30] How Asghar bootstrapped and grew Crossmedia.

[10:45] The importance of integrated media and creative partnerships, featuring the Crossmedia and Joan Creative collaboration.

[15:20] How Crossmedia is addressing client expectations around cost efficiency and transparency.

[20:05] Insights on agency leadership turnover and the evolving role of agency brands.

About the Guest:

Kamran Asghar is the CEO and founder of Crossmedia USA, an independent, data-driven media agency founded with the vision of bringing transparency and accountability to media buying.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email Brian brian@madisonandwall.com and Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com.

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore our other podcasts:

• Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.
• The M&W Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

Kevin Wassong, founder & CEO of marketing analytics startup mktg.ai, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to discuss how artificial intelligence is reshaping creative and media, and why most marketers are struggling to keep up.

Kevin explains why creative and media have been siloed for decades, how AI is accelerating the velocity of content production, and why marketers are overwhelmed by a flood of assets they can’t effectively manage. He shares how mktg.ai is tackling these challenges by creating a creative operating system that helps brands optimize content performance in real time.

Kevin also reflects on his career, from launching some of the first digital marketing initiatives at major agencies to pioneering AI-powered solutions for modern advertisers.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

A Note From Our Sponsor

FirmDecisions, part of Ebiquity Group plc, is the world's largest marketing contract compliance specialist, dedicated to enhancing commercial transparency in client-agency relationships.

With expertise across all agency types—creative, media, influencer, and shopper—FirmDecisions provide comprehensive coverage of a brand's agency portfolio.

Stop wondering if your marketing budget is working as hard as it can. Let FirmDecisions help you strengthen agency relationships, improve governance, and drive better business outcomes.

Learn more at firmdecisions.com.

Bob Lord, President of Horizon Media Holdings, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to discuss how Horizon is challenging the traditional agency model with AI, transparency, and performance-based pricing.

Bob explains why he believes the media industry is in a “Great Marketing Emergency”—lagging behind other sectors in adopting technology and transparency. He shares how Horizon’s proprietary platform, Blu+, is redefining agency-client relationships by putting more control in the hands of marketers and brands.

He also discusses the evolution of agency compensation models, the increasing demand for performance-based pricing, and why a single client making the switch could accelerate change across the industry. Bob breaks down the blurring lines between media and creative, why today’s CMOs are more tech-savvy than ever, and how independent agencies like Horizon are positioned to thrive.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

FirmDecisions, part of Ebiquity Group plc, is the world's largest marketing contract compliance specialist, dedicated to enhancing commercial transparency in client-agency relationships.

With expertise across all agency types—creative, media, influencer, and shopper—FirmDecisions provide comprehensive coverage of a brand's agency portfolio.

Stop wondering if your marketing budget is working as hard as it can. Let FirmDecisions help you strengthen agency relationships, improve governance, and drive better business outcomes.

Learn more at firmdecisions.com.

In this episode of Agency Business, co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser interview Ruben Schreurs, CEO of Ebiquity, to explore the evolving landscape of media investment and the role of media audits in maximizing ad spend.

Ruben shares insights into how brands can ensure their media dollars are working harder, the importance of transparency in agency relationships, and why now—more than ever—marketers must take a data-driven approach to media planning and buying.

From uncovering hidden inefficiencies to leveraging insights that drive real business impact, this conversation dives into the critical factors shaping today’s media investment strategies. Ruben also sheds light on the common pitfalls brands face and offers actionable advice to improve media performance across channels.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

• How media audits provide transparency and accountability for brands.
• The biggest mistakes brands make in their media investment strategies.
• Why cost efficiency doesn’t always mean effectiveness—and what to focus on instead.
• The evolving role of procurement and finance teams in media decision-making.
• Practical steps brands can take to ensure they're getting the most from their ad budgets.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email Brian brian@madisonandwall.com and Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com.

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore our other podcasts:

• Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.
• The M&W Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

In this episode of Agency Business, Brian and Olivia are joined by Joanne Davis, one of the industry's leading agency search consultants.

Joanne founded Joanne Davis Consulting in 2000 and became a partner in SCAN International in 2006 and is currently Co-CEO. The firm specializes in agency models – internal and external, agency search/selection, agency compensation and client/agency optimization and training. Clients include and have included: Benjamin Moore, Cotton (“The Fabric of Our Lives”), ExxonMobil, Johnson & Johnson, Marriott, Microsoft and Sonic.

In this episode we talk about the impact of AI on fees (and related emerging functions such as prompt engineers and creative lawyers), whether clients get the agencies they deserve, how important agency culture is and much more.

We also review news of the week covering WPP's new back-to-the-office mandate, Havas' reduced guidance and the sudden shift of Starbucks' account from WPP to Stagwell's Anomaly.

Samir Balwani, founder and CEO of media agency QRY, join co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to discuss the evolving role of media agencies, the challenges of brand awareness investments, and how independent agencies can compete with industry giants.

Samir shares thoughts on why mid-sized brands struggle with top-of-funnel marketing and how his agency bridges the gap between performance marketing and brand-building. He explains the importance of media forecasting, how QRY helps clients de-risk brand investments, and why CFOs remain skeptical about long-term marketing returns.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

A Note From Our Sponsor

FirmDecisions, part of Ebiquity Group plc, is the world's largest marketing contract compliance specialist, dedicated to enhancing commercial transparency in client-agency relationships.

With expertise across all agency types—creative, media, influencer, and shopper—FirmDecisions provide comprehensive coverage of a brand's agency portfolio.

Stop wondering if your marketing budget is working as hard as it can. Let FirmDecisions help you strengthen agency relationships, improve governance, and drive better business outcomes.

Learn more at firmdecisions.com.

Jane Crisan, CEO of Rain the Growth Agency, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to discuss how independent agencies are navigating market uncertainty, balancing media and creative, and leveraging technology to drive client growth.

Jane shares her journey from leading digital practices at holding company agencies to taking the helm at Rain, a Portland-based, female-led independent agency. She talks about Rain’s performance-driven approach, the importance of integrating creative and media strategies, and how the agency’s proprietary technology infrastructure supports speed and agility in today’s complex environment.

Plus, Olivia and Brian discuss Coca-Cola’s media account shift to Publicis, Havas’ Q4 earnings and M&A strategy, the FTC’s second request in IPG/Omnicom’s merger review, and what WPP’s plans to break up Kantar signal for the future of market research.

Subscribe to the Agency Business newsletter.

Reach Out

Agency Business works with sponsors, but it’s not pay-to-play. We consider guests who are decision-makers at the highest level of their agencies. We’d love to feature more women and leaders of color—if that's you or someone you know, please reach out:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

This episode is sponsored by Ebiquity.

Picture this: complete confidence that every dollar of your media budget is working as hard as possible.

That's what Ebiquity delivers. They are the world's leading media investment analysts, helping global brands turn media complexity into competitive advantage. Through independent, data-driven analysis, they identify inefficiencies, create transparency, and unlock hidden value in your media investments.

Over 80 of the world's largest advertisers trust Ebiquity for a reason. Visit ebiquity.com today and discover how they can help your brand.

Jon Cook, CEO of VML, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to talk about the agency’s evolution and what it means to lead a business that spans both world-class creative and deep enterprise technology.

Jon walks through how VML was formed through a series of mergers — including Wunderman, J. Walter Thompson, and Y&R — and how the newly unified brand operates across creativity, commerce, customer experience and technology. He explains the structure of VML’s Enterprise Solutions group, which makes up roughly 40 percent of the company, and why the agency’s growth often hinges on integrating those capabilities with its creative engine.

The conversation also covers AI investments, DEI policy implementation across markets, and how the agency prepares for geopolitical uncertainty while staying grounded in consistent values.

Plus, Olivia, Brian and Jon discuss:

• Havas earnings and the tone of “normal” in Q1 performance
• The brand power — and business dissonance — of Stagwell’s Sport Beach
• BarkleyOKRP’s latest acquisition and how VML thinks about fine-tuning through M&A.

Subscribe to the Agency Business newsletter.

Reach Out

Agency Business features agency CEOs and financial decision-makers alongside third party experts, including agency pitch consultants. We are always accepting pitches, and are particularly interested in hearing from women and leaders of color.

Email us!

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

This episode is sponsored by Ebiquity.

Picture this: complete confidence that every dollar of your media budget is working as hard as possible.

That's what Ebiquity delivers. They are the world's leading media investment analysts, helping global brands turn media complexity into competitive advantage. Through independent, data-driven analysis, they identify inefficiencies, create transparency, and unlock hidden value in your media investments.

Over 80 of the world's largest advertisers trust Ebiquity for a reason. Visit ebiquity.com today and discover how they can help your brand.

Co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser sit down with Chrissie Hanson, CEO of OMD USA, to discuss the evolving role of media agencies, balancing creativity with cost efficiency, and how brands can maximize the impact of their media investments.

Chrissie shares her journey from strategist to CEO, highlighting how her background in media buying and planning has shaped her leadership style. She offers a candid look at the challenges and opportunities facing agencies today, from the push for centralization within holding companies to the evolving expectations of clients navigating an increasingly complex media landscape.

From fostering a culture of innovation to leveraging data and technology for better media outcomes, this conversation explores the intersection of strategy, creativity, and business leadership in today’s agency world.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

A Note From Our Sponsor

FirmDecisions, part of Ebiquity Group plc, is the world's largest marketing contract compliance specialist, dedicated to enhancing commercial transparency in client-agency relationships.

With expertise across all agency types—creative, media, influencer, and shopper—FirmDecisions provide comprehensive coverage of a brand's agency portfolio.

Stop wondering if your marketing budget is working as hard as it can. Let FirmDecisions help you strengthen agency relationships, improve governance, and drive better business outcomes.

Learn more at firmdecisions.com.

Lisa Clunie, co-founder and CEO of JOAN joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to talk about what it takes to build and lead a modern independent agency.

From JOAN's origins in New York to its expansion into Berlin and London, Lisa shares how the company has evolved into a multi-faceted creative firm—with an advertising agency, production studio, and influencer arm—all while staying founder-owned and values-driven.

Lisa discusses the financial logic behind JOAN's production studio, how influencer marketing is diversifying beyond the “tonnage” model, and why integration across functions like creative, media, influencer, and social allows the agency to move with both agility and intention. She also explains how JOAN navigates resource allocation without external investors and how its growth decisions are often shaped by client needs and opportunity—not just ambition.

Plus, Olivia, Brian, and Lisa explore how holding companies are grappling with geopolitical and cultural tensions, what recent earnings reports from S4 Capital and M&C Saatchi suggest about agency performance, and why some agencies might regret playing it safe when it comes to their values.

Subscribe to the Agency Business newsletter.

Reach Out

Agency Business works with sponsors, but it’s not pay-to-play. We consider guests who are decision-makers at the highest level of their agencies. We’d love to feature more women and leaders of color—if that's you or someone you know, please reach out:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

This episode is sponsored by Ebiquity.

Picture this: complete confidence that every dollar of your media budget is working as hard as possible.

That's what Ebiquity delivers. They are the world's leading media investment analysts, helping global brands turn media complexity into competitive advantage. Through independent, data-driven analysis, they identify inefficiencies, create transparency, and unlock hidden value in your media investments.

Over 80 of the world's largest advertisers trust Ebiquity for a reason. Visit ebiquity.com today and discover how they can help your brand.

Simon Hill, U.S. president of FutureBrand, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to talk about what it takes to build a consultancy built around brand, inside one of the world’s largest holding companies.

Simon shares how FutureBrand operates as a brand-led strategy and design company within IPG, and how the firm balances its project-based model with the broader agency network. He discusses FutureBrand’s role at critical moments of change for clients—like M&A, private equity transitions, and category disruptions—and how the team works alongside AORs and sibling agencies across IPG to shape brands from the inside out.

Simon also explains how FutureBrand competes with both management consultancies and independent shops, why brand experience has become a priority for clients navigating commoditized categories, and how the firm thinks about talent, offshoring, and cross-border collaboration.

Plus, Olivia, Brian, and Simon dig into the news of the week, including:

• Stagwell’s bold projections for 9% annual organic growth and its surprisingly dismissive take on tariffs.
• WPP’s acquisition of data clean room provider Infosum, and what it signals about the industry’s growing appetite for software businesses.
• New Madison and Wall data on independent agency growth trends and why headcount is up at some performance-focused agencies.

Subscribe to the Agency Business newsletter.

Reach Out

Agency Business features agency CEOs and financial decision-makers alongside third party experts, including agency pitch consultants. We are always accepting pitches, and are particularly interested in hearing from women and leaders of color.

Please reach out:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

This episode is sponsored by Ebiquity.

Picture this: complete confidence that every dollar of your media budget is working as hard as possible.

That's what Ebiquity delivers. They are the world's leading media investment analysts, helping global brands turn media complexity into competitive advantage. Through independent, data-driven analysis, they identify inefficiencies, create transparency, and unlock hidden value in your media investments.

Over 80 of the world's largest advertisers trust Ebiquity for a reason. Visit ebiquity.com today and discover how they can help your...

Nicole Estebanell, U.S. CEO of Mediahub, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to talk about what it means to lead a challenger agency inside one of the world’s largest media networks.

Nicole walks through her career journey, beginning with her early media roles at Digitas and Neo to later leading the Nike account at Mindshare, serving as global chief client officer at Initiative, and now taking the reins in the U.S. for Mediahub. She reflects on the client and agency-side experiences that shaped her commercial instincts, what it means to build integrated teams today, and how to preserve Mediahub’s challenger DNA even as it scales.

She also shares how Mediahub is positioned within IPG’s Mediabrands group, how the agency evaluates inbound RFPs, and why clients increasingly ask their media agencies to solve for more than media.

Plus, Olivia and Brian discuss: 

• Publicis Groupe’s strong Q1 earnings, and why it’s outpacing peers on growth
• Omnicom’s more modest Q1 results and how principal media trading is shaping holding company margins
• Omnicom scaling its influencer marketing under the Creo brand name.

Subscribe to the Agency Business newsletter.

Reach Out

Agency Business features agency CEOs and financial decision-makers alongside third party experts including agency pitch consultants. We are always accepting pitches, and are particularly interested in hearing from women and leaders of color.

Email us!

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work — plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia's Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

This episode is sponsored by Ebiquity.

Picture this: complete confidence that every dollar of your media budget is working as hard as possible.

That's what Ebiquity delivers. They are the world's leading media investment analysts, helping global brands turn media complexity into competitive advantage. Through independent, data-driven analysis, they identify inefficiencies, create transparency, and unlock hidden value in your media investments....

In this episode of Agency Business, we're joined for a fascinating conversation with independent agency FerebeeLane's co-founders to talk about working with high-end brands, broadening service offerings, global expansion and how Matt and Josh manage their business more generally.

We also discuss recent industry news including the appointment of Bob Lord at Horizon, recent results at Accenture and the politicization of advertising.

On our debut episode, Olivia and Brian interview Paul Woolmington, CEO of Canvas Worldwide to talk about his experiences as a leader in the agency industry. We discuss a significant amount of history given his foundational role establishing media agencies as stand-alone businesses (at Y&R and The Media Kitchen) and co-founding Naked, which pioneered communications planning. We also review agency industry news from the first week of December, including IPG's sale of Huge and layoffs at Edelman, with a conversation focusing on the bigger picture impacting both of those businesses.

Kern Schireson, chairman & CEO of Known, joins co-hosts Olivia Morley and Brian Wieser to break down what’s wrong with today’s agency model and how data, AI, and a new approach to transparency could fix it.

Kern shares his journey from building a data science consultancy to leading Viacom’s advanced TV efforts and ultimately launching Known, an agency designed to address the inefficiencies of traditional holding company structures.

He shares his viewpoints on why separating media and creative has led to broken marketing strategies, how Known is applying AI to optimize media performance, and why the agency’s consulting-inspired business model is designed to align directly with client outcomes.

Plus, Brian and Olivia discuss agency holding company earnings, the latest M&A activity in adland, and how independent agencies are positioning themselves against industry giants.

Subscribe to the Agency Business newsletter.

Reach Out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email:

📩 Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com

📩 Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com

Follow Madison and Wall and FusionFront Media on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore Our Other Podcasts:

📊 The Madison and Wall Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial, and industry trends.

🎬 Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.

A Note From Our Sponsor

This episode is sponsored by Ebiquity.

Picture this: complete confidence that every dollar of your media budget is working as hard as possible.

That's what Ebiquity delivers. They are the world's leading media investment analysts, helping global brands turn media complexity into competitive advantage. Through independent, data-driven analysis, they identify inefficiencies, create transparency, and unlock hidden value in your media investments.

Over 80 of the world's largest advertisers trust Ebiquity for a reason. Visit ebiquity.com today and discover how they can help your brand.

In this episode of Agency Business, Brian Wieser and Olivia Morley are joined by Jay Pattisall, vice president and principal analyst at Forrester, to discuss the biggest agency news of the year (and probably the decade): Omnicom’s acquisition of IPG. Wieser, Morley, and Pattisall share their insights into the implications of this deal, including:

• What the acquisition signals about the future of agency holding companies.
• How IPG’s media and creative operations might integrate into Omnicom’s structure.
• Why consolidation of brands seems likely, despite public assurances to the contrary.

The discussion also explores broader trends in the agency world, such as:

• The Forrester Wave for media and creative agencies.
• Intelligent creativity—where AI and advertising services intersect.
• How agencies are incorporating technology into their service models to create new revenue opportunities.

Key Moments:

• [1:50] Introducing Jay Pattisall and his role at Forrester.
• [3:15] Exploring the Forrester Wave, intelligent creativity, and key industry trends.
• [8:40] Are agencies becoming software companies? Wieser, Morley, and Pattisall reflect on the concept.
• [12:00] Breaking down Omnicom’s acquisition of IPG—what it means for agency brands and operations.
• [16:30] Predictions on consolidation and restructuring within Omnicom Media Group and creative networks.

About the Guest:

Jay Pattisall is a vice president and principal analyst at Forrester, where he conducts research on agency performance, advertising and marketing trends, the intersection of AI and creativity, and more. Learn more about Jay and his work on his Forrester analyst page.

Reach out

For sponsorship inquiries or to discuss potential guests, email Brian at brian@madisonandwall.com and Olivia at olivia@fusionfrontmedia.com.

Follow FusionFront Media on LinkedIn and Madison and Wall on LinkedIn for updates.

Explore our other podcasts:

• Screen & Sponsor – Olivia & VaynerMedia media manager Jessie Holder explore how brands are shaping Hollywood.
• The M&W Podcast – Brian opens up about his latest work—plus crucial economic, financial and other trends industry leaders should be watching.