The Case for Conservation Podcast (www.case4conservation.com)
Explore every episode of The Case for Conservation Podcast
| Pub. Date | Title | Duration | |
|---|---|---|---|
| 06 Feb 2022 | 19. Is aquaculture good or bad for the environment? (Roz Naylor) | 00:44:20 | |
Itâs widely agreed that one of our greatest global environmental challenges is the impact of fisheries on the oceans. Aquaculture, practiced at a small scale around the world and especially in Asia for centuries, emerged decades ago as a potential solution. But it soon became clear that aquaculture was using more wild-caught fish as feed (as an input), than it was generating as product. In other words, it was making the situation even worse. However, things have changed in the way that we manage this final frontier of agricultural intensification. And this story is not all about the ocean. Mariculture - marine aquaculture - supplies more than 50% of the worldâs seafood, but the freshwater aquaculture is even larger than the mariculture industry. Aquaculture is a big deal. I spoke about this subject with economist Roz Naylor, a professor of earth system science at Stanford University's Center for Food Security and the Environment. She led a seminal review to examine the "Effect of aquaculture on world fish supplies", which was published in the journal, Nature, in 2000. Twenty years later she led the publication of "A 20-year retrospective review of global aquaculture", again in Nature. Both papers took an exhaustive look at all the literature available at the time, to piece together comprehensive narratives that outlined the pros and cons; the advances and obstacles of one of humankind's most important and promising food systems, and its impact on the environment. | |||
| 07 Mar 2022 | 20. Is renewable energy better for biodiversity? (Alexandros Gasparatos) | 00:47:30 | |
Renewable energy is one of the great hopes of humankind when it comes to addressing the threat of climate change and some forms of pollution. Thanks to technological advances itâs now become cost-effective enough to compete with non-renewable energy sources. As renewable energy technologies and efficiency continue improving, and new innovations emerge, itâs hoped that we can make clean energy ubiquitous. But, as Thomas Sowell said, "there are no solutions - only trade-offs". The harm done by energy generation is not just about the gasses emitted during the generation process. Itâs also about where renewable energy infrastructure is located; the materials that are mined and transported to build energy infrastructure; the batteries to store energy from non-baseload sources; the waste produced when energy infrastructure needs to be renewed; and, of most relevance to todayâs discussion, the relative impacts of different forms of energy production on biodiversity. Alexandros Gasparatos is Associate Professor of Sustainability Science at the Institute for Future Initiatives at the University of Tokyo; and Adjunct Associate Professor at the United Nations University Institute for the Advanced Study of Sustainability, also in Tokyo. He is an ecological economist interested in, among many other things, renewable energy and energy policy. In my conversation with him he makes clear above all, I think, that the relationship between energy production (from both renewable and non-renewable sources) and biodiversity is highly complex and what constitutes best solutions can be context-dependent. | |||
| 04 Apr 2022 | 21. How can we better understand environmental change? (Timm Hoffman) | 00:50:59 | |
In 1975, biologist Paul Ehrlich said that 90% of tropical rainforests would be lost by about 2005. Although their loss has continued at a steady rate, by 2019 the figure was more like 32%. Also in the 1970s, ecologist Kenneth Watt forecast a world 11 degrees colder in the year 2000. Of course, itâs been well publicized that the trend is in the opposite direction, and at a less severe pace. At a more modest scale, botanist John Acocks predicted in the 1950s that South Africa's Karoo (a desert-like area the size of present-day Germany) would expand into neighboring ecosystems, amounting to the desertification of millions of hectares of the country. As youâll hear in todayâs discussion, the Karoo in fact appears to have decreased in size. There are plenty of other examples of predictions of environmental change proving to be completely wrong. Perhaps those making the predictions didn't spend enough time looking into the past in order to forecast the future; and perhaps they didn't consult a diverse enough pool of expertise to inform their predictions. Timm Hoffman is a professor of plant conservation at the University of Cape Town (UCT) who, for decades, has used a variety of techniques to understand changes in biodiversity and landscapes. I have long admired Timm for the humility with which he approaches this subject. We talk about the methods he uses, especially repeat photography, and about the role of community engagement. And Timm argues that an interdisciplinary approach to ecology and conservation is likely to give us the best idea of what is going on. This episode is focused on southern Africa, but Iâm sure youâll find the lessons universally applicable.
02:35: Are conservationists too confident in their assumptions about environmental change? | |||
| 02 May 2022 | 22. Trophy hunting: Who's to judge? (Lochran Traill) | 00:44:20 | |
Most people outside Africa probably donât associate trophy hunting with conservation. In fact, certain publicized incidents of trophy hunting have caused something of a global moral panic. The same often goes for the culling of animal populations to manage their numbers and the trade in ivory, even ivory harvested from elephants that die naturally. In todayâs discussion we get into these perceptions, and my guest explains why they may be misguided. Lochran Traill is a lecturer at the University of Leeds. He is a conservation biologist and, having grown up in Zimbabwe, specializes in African ecology and conservation. Among the many topics he has researched and published on in top journals, is the afore-mentioned trophy hunting. Our discussion focuses on, but is not limited to, his most recent paper, on divergent views on trophy hunting in Africa, especially between people in Africa, and people outside the continent.
... coming soon | |||
| 05 Jun 2022 | 23. How alarmed should we be about the environment? (Matt Ridley) | 00:51:05 | |
This episode is about environmental alarmism. Alarmism means exaggerating danger and thereby causing needless worry or panic. These days the media is flooded with proclamations and predictions of ecological catastrophe. There is no doubt that our environmental challenges are many, and huge, and they certainly do present dangers. But are they being seen in the context of broader developmental challenges and associated trade-offs? Or in the context of humankind's past achievements, and our ability to adapt? And is alarmist rhetoric the best way to motivate action to deal with them? Among the people offering answers to questions like these, is this monthâs guest on The Case for Conservation Podcast, Matt Ridley. Matt was, until he retired last year, an elected member of the UK Parliamentâs House of Lords. Heâs been been writer and/or editor for The Economist and The Wall Street Journal, among other publications, and his non-fiction books have sold more than a million copies. They include "The Rational Optimist", "The Evolution of Everything", "How Innovation Works" and, most recently, "Viral: The Search for the Origin of COVID-19". His 2010 TED talk, "When Ideas Have Sex", has been viewed more than 2 and a half million times, and heâs spoken on various other popular forums including, quite recently, the Jordan Peterson Podcast.
| |||
| 04 Jul 2022 | 24. Can GMOs benefit biodiversity? (Joseph Opoku Gakpo) | 00:51:08 | |
Few technologies are viewed with as much suspicion as genetic modification. Genetically modified organisms (GMOs) are banned in several parts of the world; an entire protocol under the Convention on Biological Diversity (CBD) is dedicated to controlling their effects on biodiversity; and national and international agreements and regulations tightly legislate their use across a broad range of applications. Why, then, do GMOs continue to grow in popularity? Why do farmers in the developing world consider them game-changing tools to deal with the demands of making a living, or even a livelihood, from agriculture? And what's all this subversive business about GMOs being good for biodiversity? Joseph Opoku Gakpo is an environmental journalist who writes about GMOs and other aspects of agriculture, the environment, and rural development. He is Ghana correspondent for "Alliance for Science", and was awarded the Ghana Journalists Association prize for Best Journalist in Poverty Alleviation Reporting in 2015. Joseph has a passion for sharing the struggle of farmers and other rural people, which is reflected in his refreshingly clear and level-headed style of reporting. In this illuminating discussion we talk about how GMOs got such a bad name; whether any of the allegations against them are reasonable; what they mean for poor people around the world; and what is the nature of their relationship with biodiversity.
Time stamps: | |||
| 01 Aug 2022 | 25. Why could urbanization save biodiversity? (Eric Sanderson) | 00:57:38 | |
Cities - even the greenest of them - replace nature with glass, concrete and asphalt. And their footprint extends far beyond their boundaries to provide for the needs of the thousands, millions, or ten of millions of people concentrated within them. They are home to most of the people on Earth and are the sources of most pollution. But it seems cities are also an inevitable result of the development of civilization. They are growing in size and number, especially in some of the most biodiverse and least spoiled part of the planet. So, does that mean they are a fundamental obstacle to conservation? Should conservationists be trying to de-urbanize? My guest for this episode of The Case for Conservation Podcast answers those questions with an emphatic "no". Eric Sanderson is a landscape ecologist and Senior Conservation Ecologist at the Wildlife Conservation Society, based at the Bronx Zoo in New York. He has authored more than 100 peer-reviewed papers and other publications on a wide range of conservation topics. These include two books, one of which, Manahatta: A Natural History of New York City, was a New York Times bestseller when it was published in 2009. See episode 6 with Debra Roberts for another look at cities and conservation, from a different angle Links to resources:
Time stamps: | |||
| 03 Oct 2022 | 26. Perceptions of science communication (Neil Waters & Erin Kawazu) | 00:39:42 | |
Covid-19 has, probably more than anything, ever, made science communication a matter of public interest. A couple of weeks before recording this episode, the journal BioScience published an article that I co-authored, which takes a critical look at one aspect of science messaging - the way it has portrayed the relationship between land change and infectious disease risk. That paper will actually be the focus of next month's episode of the podcast, but this month I am joined by two of my young co-authors on that paper to discuss science communication more generally. All three of us are science communicators in some sense, but we're novices in this field. So this is not an authoritative overview but rather a discussion of perceptions based on what we have observed, especially over the past couple of years. Neil Waters is a Canadian ecologist who has been studying and working in Tokyo, where he currently teaches science writing. Erin Kawazu is part of the communications team at the Institute for Global Environmental Strategies (IGES) in Hayama, not far from Tokyo, where I also work. She has a background in health and the environment. Links to resources:
Time stamps: coming soon | |||
| 07 Nov 2022 | 27. Deforestation and zoonotic disease spillover - a complex relationship (Andre Mader) | 00:28:06 | |
This month, for the first time, I am the interviewee rather than the interviewer. This episode was recorded for BioScience Talks, the podcast of the journal BioScience, which recently published an article that I co-authored. The article is about science and media communication around Covid-19 and, in particular, the way that some of the scientific literature, and much of the media, have portrayed the relationship between land change and disease spillover risk. To be clear, my co-authors and I are not suggesting that the destruction of nature is not a key driver of spillover. There is plenty of evidence that it is. We are pointing out why this is not always the case, and why itâs risky to imply that it is. | |||
| 19 Dec 2022 | 28a. Politics, the media, and the environment (Esther Krakue) | 00:43:56 | |
After decades of struggling for recognition, environmental issues, including biodiversity conservation, have exploded onto the global scene in recent years. This is incredibly encouraging and gratifying, but are we sufficiently aware of the risks that come with such vastly increased public support? How much is politics influencing the public discourse on the environment? Are we paying enough attention to other, interrelated, societal goals and the trade-offs between them? Esther Krakue is a young broadcaster, writer, and talk TV contributor. Sheâs been on the media scene for only a few years, but she features on various well-known TV channels, podcasts and other forums. She has some strong opinions on how environmentalism, especially environmental activism, may be heading in the wrong direction, and could even threaten the movement itself.
| |||
| 14 Jan 2023 | 28b. Politics, the media, and the environment (Omnia El Omrani) | 00:44:02 | |
After decades of struggling for recognition, environmental issues, including biodiversity conservation, have exploded onto the global scene in recent years. This is incredibly encouraging and gratifying, but are we sufficiently aware of the risks that come with such vastly increased public support? How much is politics influencing the public discourse on the environment? Are we paying enough attention to other, interrelated, societal goals and the trade-offs between them? | |||
| 05 Feb 2023 | 29. Biodiversity offsets: A necessary evil? (Martine Maron) | 00:41:09 | |
In days gone by development (of cities, infrastructure, agriculture, etc.) happened without regard for the environment. And it was really the devastating effects of unimpeded development that led to the establishment and early growth of the environmental movement, broadly speaking. We have become much more efficient at using land and other resources, but development remains inevitable. In theory, biodiversity offsets cancel out the effect of development by conserving biodiversity "elsewhere". But thatâs just theory. Biodiversity offsets are controversial for a number of reasons. It is, however, likely that we are stuck with them as a tool to mitigate biodiversity loss. Joining me on episode 29 of The Case for Conservation Podcast is ecologist at the University if Queensland, Martine Maron. For much of her career Martine has been researching offsets, and doing her best to make sure they are properly implemented. In our discussion she explains what they are, why weâre stuck with them, and how to make the most of them. Â Links to resources
| |||
| 06 Mar 2023 | 30. Multilateral environmental agreements - MEAs (Peter Bridgewater) | 00:57:32 | |
Wherever conservation takes place, at whatever scale, and in whatever form, thereâs a good chance that it is somehow affected by the decisions taken under multilateral environmental agreements, or âMEAsâ. These agreements, such as the Convention on Biological Diversity, are made between multiple countries - sometimes including almost all of the world's nations - with the aim of addressing one or another environmental challenge. There are now hundreds of MEAs, set up to guide national and subnational actions toward a more sustainable future. They are supported by secretariats that coordinate their work and convene large international meetings between the countries that have signed up to them. And yet, most conservationists are unaware of how these high-level agreements work, or how well they work. Peter Bridgewater is a veteran of various MEA negotiations, and has published extensively about biodiversity MEAs in particular. Among various professorships and other positions, he was the Secretary General of the oldest biodiversity MEA, the Ramsar Convention, between 2003 and 2007. In our discussion Peter explains what MEAs are, and he speaks frankly about their importance, their potential, and their shortcomings. Links to resources
| |||
| 03 Apr 2023 | 31. Biodiversity risk and the law (Zaneta Sedilekova) | 00:43:20 | |
You may have heard of the concept of âbiodiversity riskâ, especially in the context of business. It has become increasingly widely used in recent years and the Task Force on Nature-related Financial Disclosures (TNFD) is a recent development that has done a lot to popularize the concept. But what exactly is biodiversity risk and, for that matter, what is TNFD? Why has this topic been gathering so much steam lately, and what are some of the possible drawbacks of its progress? With us to demystify these and related questions is Zaneta Sedilekova. Zaneta is a lawyer specializing in climate and biodiversity risk, based in the UK. She is director of the climate and biodiversity risk consultancy firm, Climate Law Lab and Biodiversity Risk Advisor at the Commonwealth Climate and Law Initiative. Links to resources
| |||
| 04 May 2023 | 32. When should we question environmental orthodoxy? (Russell Galt) | 00:42:54 | |
There is a tendency in societies to adhere to conventional wisdom. We resist challenges to consensus views, and may even dismiss those who do challenge them as conspiracy theorists... which they sometimes are. But perhaps we take that idea too far sometimes. Perhaps we underestimate the importance of having the freedom to challenge orthodoxy. We live in an age in which more people than ever before are lucky enough to inhabit free societies, but recently it has become âconventionalâ to take issue with some of these hard-earned freedoms - albeit often with good intentions. Even people who donât follow the news cycle must be familiar with the concepts of cancel culture and de-platforming. In this episode we discuss the notion of questioning orthodoxy, with a focus on the environment and especially conservation. My guest is Russell Galt, Head of Policy and Science at Earthwatch Europe, and previously Senior Programme Coordinator of IUCNâs work on urban conservation and Young Champions of the Earth Coordinator with the United Nations Environment Programme. Russell recently complete a Master of Business Administration at the University of Edinburgh, to complement his earlier studies in ecology.
| |||
| 05 Jun 2023 | 33. Is ESG investing good for biodiversity? (Ken Pucker) | 00:46:08 | |
ESG is the latest buzzword in business & biodiversity circles, but itâs not actually new - only newly popular. And itâs one among many terms and acronyms in this field, which may be familiar but are often poorly understood - ESG stands for âenvironmental, social and governanceâ investing criteria. Understanding concepts like ESG is consequential because their success relies largely on convincing the general public of their value and their virtue. As we discuss in this episode, however, they are not necessarily all that theyâre made out to be. To elucidate this topic with me is Ken Pucker. Ken is a professor at the Fletcher School at Tufts University and Advisory Director at the Boston-based Financial Services firm, Berkshire Partners. He was previously Chief Operating Officer of the outdoor footwear and apparel company, Timberland, one of the first companies to take an interest in sustainable production. He has written extensively on ESG and related issues in Harvard Business Review among other publications. Timestamps 01:47 A brief history of CSR, ESG, and sustainability reporting Links to resources
| |||
| 02 Jul 2023 | 34. Is there still hope for the worldâs corals? (Mike Emslie) | 00:47:03 | |
Historically, the oceans have received too little attention in discussions about the environment and biodiversity. On the topic of biodiversity loss in particular, however, one marine system has attracted almost as much attention as the rainforests: coral reefs. Coral reefs have even been described as the rainforests of the sea, thanks to their remarkably high levels of biodiversity. Recently, United Nations agencies have been voicing the alarming prediction that the world could lose as much as 99% of its corals within decades, if there is a 2 degree centigrade increase in average global temperature. Meanwhile, however, on the worldâs largest reef system, the Great Barrier Reef, a 2021 survey had more positive news. It found that hard coral cover, which is used as a proxy for the health of coral reefs, is at its highest levels since the 1980s. Thatâs despite global temperatures already having risen by one degree over the past century. So, is the public being misled by messages of doom and gloom? Or are these seemingly contradictory messages somehow reconcilable? With me to answer this central question about corals is Mike Emslie. Mike is head of the Great Barrier Reef Monitoring Programme and senior researcher at the Australian Institute for Marine Science (AIMS). Timestamps 02:29 What are corals, where are they found, and why are they important? Links to resources
| |||
| 07 Aug 2023 | 35. Are we obsessed with species? (Frank Zachos) | 00:55:09 | |
Species. We take them for granted as the main currency of biodiversity. But how many of us really know what species are? And do we attach too much importance to them, especially in the context of conservation?
Links to resources
| |||
| 04 Sep 2023 | 36. Biodiversity & agriculture: appreciating the trade-offs (Prabhu Pingali) | 00:41:44 | |
In decades past, conservation was notorious for ignoring other development goals. These days, its focus has expanded to consider those other goals, including the prevention of poverty and hunger. In fact, there seems to be a tendency to assume that conservation is always compatible with them, and necessary to achieve them. There is certainly truth in that, but are we talking enough about the inevitable trade-offs? And if everyone agrees that we should minimize trade-offs, why is the Green Revolution - one of the greatest âtrade-off minimizersâ in history often vilified by environmentalists? In this episode of The Case for Conservation Podcast, Prabhu Pingali shares his thoughts on the green revolution, and more generally on trade-offs between development goals. Prabhu is Professor of Applied Economics at Cornell University and has worked in senior positions at the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, FAO, the CGIAR, and other key development institutions. Links to resources
| |||
| 02 Oct 2023 | 37. What is climate change doing to biodiversity? (Adam Welz) | 00:58:31 | |
Climate change gets a lot more attention and funding than biodiversity. But, as conservation organizations are keen to point out, climate and biodiversity are intimately linked and there is, therefore, a good argument for addressing them side by side. Part of that argument is that conserving biodiversity is good for the climate. But an even more obvious link is that climate affects biodiversity. Human beings can adapt rapidly to change through innovation. But nature adapts over evolutionary time, much slower than the predicted changes in climate. And yet the countless books that continue be produced about climate change, are almost exclusively focused on its effects on humankind.  Adam Welz, however, has just released a highly acclaimed book to fill this gap, âThe End of Edenâ. Adam is a writer, photographer, filmmaker and self-proclaimed conservation theorist with a long-standing interest in the effects of climate change on biodiversity. We interrogate this big subject, and Adamâs book in particular, in his second appearance on the podcast. In case you missed it, the last time was episode 11, in June 2021, when we discussed the problems with âperformative conservationâ. Links to resources
| |||
| 08 Nov 2023 | 38. Should science and activism be kept separate? (Andrea Bandelli) | 00:41:44 | |
This monthâs episode is about activism and science communication, and whether or not they should be combined. There are obvious tensions here because science is meant to be as objective as possible, while activism is characteristically impulsive and political. And, of course, there can be activists on both sides of a debate. There can also be incomplete or poorly reported science, upon which that activism is based. On the other hand, could there be a role for scientists to guide activism, making it more rooted in fact, more strategic, and more appealing in its approach? Andrea Bandelli is a science communicator, and former Head of International Relations at the Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam, in The Netherlands. He helps to unravel this topic, pointing out that activism need not be âbrutalâ, and arguing for more overlap between science communicators and activists. Links to resources
| |||
| 13 Dec 2023 | 39. The global biodiversity targets (Alice Hughes) | 00:48:16 | |
Many conservation managers and scientists may not be aware that there is a single, common set of global biodiversity targets that inform national conservation strategy in almost every country in the world. These 23 targets are the main part of the âKunming-Montreal Global Biodiversity Frameworkâ, or GBF. The GBF was agreed on by Parties to the Convention on Biological Diversity (CBD) in late 2022, and the targets are meant to be achieved by 2030. This is a monumental task, considering that the multi-year strategy that preceded the GBF, which concluded in 2020, unfortunately failed to fully achieve any of its targets. The GBF is also accompanied by a monitoring framework of indictors for countries to measure their success toward achieving the GBFâs targets. That monitoring framework is still being compiled, and an âad hoc technical expert groupâ has been tasked to guide its development and completion by late 2024. The GBF and its monitoring framework might seem distant and disconnected from on-the-ground conservation but they can be hugely influential on prioritization of conservation worldwide. Conservationists of any kind would probably benefit from a better understanding of whatâs behind them, and whatâs inside them.
| |||
| 12 Jan 2024 | 40. Should we resurrect extinct species? (Virginia Matzek) | 00:52:42 | |
As a result of our success as a species, we have been ushering other species toward extinction for thousands of years. The pace of those extinctions increased markedly with the growth of the worldâs population since the Industrial Revolution. But we are now within reach of the âJurassic Parkâ -type fantasy of being able to reverse extinctions - to bring back species from the dead. On the other hand, assuming we get beyond the remaining technological obstacles, de-extinction is still a very complex topic with conservation and ecological considerations that are not necessarily being considered by those who are most likely to make it happen. Virginia Matzek is a restoration ecologist and professor at Santa Clara University, who navigates us through this convoluted subject. The first part of the discussion is an explanation of how de-extinction âworksâ. After that, we get into the various arguments âforâ and âagainstâ. Virginia is remarkably even-handed in her treatment of both sides of the argument, and some of her reasons are not  what one might expect. Links to resources
| |||
| 05 Feb 2024 | 41. Is capitalism bad for the environment? (Russell Galt) | 00:51:08 | |
Capitalism gets a lot of negative press these days, and one of the main arguments against it is the environmental degradation with which itâs associated. But how much is capitalism itself responsible, and how much are people conflating it with associated phenomena? Are the realistic alternatives any better, or should our efforts be focused on reforming this system, which has already done so much for human flourishing? Russell Galt has many thoughts about the problems with capitalism, but he is also wary of how we go about changing the system. Russell is Head of Policy and Science at Earthwatch Europe, a Partner at the sustainability consultancy, Value-based Work, and Chief Development Officer at Urban Biodiversity Hub. Heâs also a friend, upon whom I know I can rely for an honest opinion, and he recently completed an MBA to add to his environmental qualifications. This discussion attempts to touch on various aspects of the arguments for and against capitalism in the context of the environment. The main point is to illustrate the complexities of the issue, rather than to arrive at definitive answers to my questions.
| |||
| 04 Mar 2024 | 42. Political polarization in sustainability science? (Ărjan Bodin) | 00:44:05 | |
Sustainability science, which includes conservation biology and various other environmental studies, is not a âhard scienceâ like physics or mathematics. Nevertheless, one might expect it to be reasonably independent of political affiliation. But is this the case? If not, what is the problem with leaning too far in one political direction, especially if that direction is left and generally considered to be âpro environmentâ? If it is a problem, what can we do about it? Ărjan Bodin is a sustainability scientist at the Stockholm Resilience Centre at Stockholm University, who has thought a lot about this topic and published a recent paper on it. Ărjan is quick to point out that he has not formally studied political polarization. However, with decades of research experience in sustainability science, he provides some compelling reasons why we should pay attention to this overlooked but potentially highly consequential issue.
| |||
| 30 Mar 2024 | 43. What is stealth advocacy in conservation? (Françoise Cardou) | 00:38:53 | |
Conservation and sustainability scientists are often expected to advise policymakers and other decision-makers. But some of the issues that they are expected to advise on, have broader consensus than others. So, when is it appropriate to advise? When is it appropriate to advocate? When should they simply present all the options or interpretations, and leave it to the decision-makers? Françoise Cardou is a plant and a community ecologist and postdoctoral fellow at Carlton University in Ottawa, interested in understanding how people and nature affect each other in socio-ecological systems. In a recent paper in Biological Conservation, she and her colleague Mark Vellend discuss how important it is for conservation scientists to know which role is appropriate, to avoid being so-called âstealth advocatesâ. Links to resources
| |||
| 29 Apr 2024 | 44. What happened to the Anthropocene? (Erle Ellis) | 00:41:32 | |
Humankindâs transformation of the Earth is embodied in the idea that we are living in the âAnthropoceneâ. Most people who have heard of this concept were probably unaware that it describes a specific unit of geological measurement - an epoch. A debate has been ongoing for more than a decade about whether to make that designation official - for the Anthropocene to take over from the Holocene epoch. This debate concluded just a few weeks ago with a definitive ânoâ. In this episode of The Case for Conservation Podcast renowned Anthropocene expert Erle Ellis explains what happened to the Anthropocene⊠and why it doesnât really matter that it was rejected as an epoch. Erle is an environmental scientist who divides his academic time between the university of Maryland in the US, and Oxford University in the UK. He is a prolific author and public commentator on this and related topics. Links to resources
| |||
| 11 Jun 2024 | 45. Are we really facing âinsectageddonâ? (Jane Hill) | 00:40:47 | |
Insects are among the most abundant organisms on Earth. About 350,000 beetle species, alone, have been described by science and this is considered to be only a fraction of their total number. In a variety of ways, insects are a fundamental part of natural and human-adapted systems. While some cause disease or ruin crops, others play a key role in ecosystem service provision, for example by pollinating certain crops or as food for other beneficial animals and people. Overall, the loss of insect species is a major concern. Some of the more exuberant headlines broadcasting this message have gone so far as to declare an imminent âinsectageddonâ. However, although many insect species are declining or in danger of decline, there is reason to be wary of such excessive claims. Data need to be carefully considered, revealing the complex patterns of change. Unfortunately the media, in particular, is often incentivized to focus on the more extreme findings and neglect the nuances. Jane Hill (OBE) is president of the Royal Entomological Society and a professor at the University of York. She helps me to pick apart the "insectageddon" idea, including how valid it is and how it came about in the first place. Links to Resources
| |||
| 06 Jul 2024 | 46. Can agriculture become nature-friendly at scale? (Philippe Birker) | 00:46:54 | |
Agriculture has been by far the biggest driver of land change and land degradation worldwide. And yet, it is also fundamental to the very existence of humankind. This mismatch often comes up in public discourse. Over the past year or two, for example, several European countries have seen extensive farmer protests - against rising costs and restrictive environmental regulations, among other things. Environmental groups have responded to the farmersâ appeals mostly with indignation⊠and yet farmers and environmentalists have a lot in common - at east potentially. Philippe Birker is co-founder of âClimate Farmersâ, and his work is aimed mostly at promoting regenerative agriculture. He and I cover a range of topics in the discussion that follows, from the farmer protests to the relationship between agrochemical companies and government. Along the way, there were several ârabbit holesâ that we could have gone down, and several points that I would have liked to challenge Philippe on in greater depth. But, with limited available time, I needed to bookmark most of these for another time and for future guests. | |||
| 05 Aug 2024 | 47. Why is whaling still... a thing? (Joji Morishita) | 00:59:35 | |
There are few environmental issues more emotive than the hunting of whales. Although the focus of environmentalists has shifted to other topics in recent times, whaling remains contentious whenever it is brought up. This is understandable considering that, for the first half of the 20th century and into the 1970s, several whale species were hunted to near-extinction. But as crude oil took over from whale oil as the fuel of industry whale populations began making impressive recoveries. Nevertheless, a handful of countries and populations continue to hunt them, much to the chagrin of the rest of the world. Perhaps the most high profile whaling country is Japan. To add to the saga, in 2019 Japan ended about seven decades of membership of the International Whaling Commission (IWC) - the global body responsible for the âmanagement of whaling and conservation of whalesâ. There are countless sources providing the anti-whaling point of view, to some of which I will provide links in the podcast description. But comprehensive accounts of the other side of the story are less easy to find. Joji Morishita has been, among many other things, Japanâs Commissioner to the IWC (2013 - 2018) and IWC Chair (2016 - 2018) and I doubt there is any better person in the world to tell Japanâs side of the whaling story. In this fascinating discussion he explains why Japan withdrew from the IWC, and he takes on many of the core arguments against whaling. Links to resources
| |||
| 02 Sep 2024 | 48. What about free market environmentalism? (Ronald Bailey) | 00:45:31 | |
Protection of the environment is strongly associated with regulation of the human activities that threaten it, and regulation is usually administered by government. Although almost everyone would probably agree that some regulation is necessary, regulation has a patchy record when it comes to environmental protection. And there is another approach to achieving environmental goals. Free market environmentalism, instead of protecting nature from market forces, harnesses those forces to protect nature. Or at least that's the idea. Ronald Bailey is the longtime science writer for Reason Magazine, a renowned American libertarian news & opinion outlet thatâs been around for more than 50 years. Ron joins me to flesh out the case for free market environmentalism. Links to resources
| |||
| 08 Oct 2024 | 49. Should we worry about zombie organizations? (Julia Gray) | 00:42:27 | |
International organizations, or âIOsâ for short, are typically organizations to which multiple countries belong as members. They cover virtually every aspect of human endeavor and there are many that are related to environmental protection. International organizations may influence our lives quite profoundly and yet, outside our own field, we might struggle to name more than a few of them. Furthermore, it has been proposed that most of them are not functioning entities, but rather so-calledâzombie organizationsâ. Thatâs what Julia Gray has suggested. Julia is an associate professor of political science at the University of Pennsylvania, who has been researching zombie organizations for years. She joins me to explain how zombie organizations come about; why we donât notice them; and what are their consequences. Links to resources
| |||
| 12 Nov 2024 | 50. How do we get to a more sustainable society? (Sharachchandra Lele) | 00:58:10 | |
Half a century ago a group of more than 2,000 scientists signed a warning of environmental crisis and nuclear war. Named after the French town where it was compiled, the âMenton Messageâ turned out to be somewhat hyperbolic in its environmental predictions, and did not account for some of humankindâs remarkable developmental progress over the following decades. However, some of its concerns certainly remain prescient today. And so another, smaller, group of scientists convened, on the 50-year anniversary of the Menton Message, to revisit and modernize some of its assertions. The resulting document is âA letter to fellow citizens of Earthâ, which was also summarized in an article for the journal âNatureâ. It makes three key points:
Although the new letter acknowledges some of the progress that we have made since the Menton Message, it emphasizes the threats and asserts the urgent need for change. Sharachchandra Lele is one of the two main authors of the 2022 letter, and the Nature article. I pushed him on the accuracy of some of the letterâs claims and assertions. The resulting conversation interrogates different aspects of the letter, and questions the idea that we are on completely the wrong track to make things right. Our conversation jumps around a bit and does not follow the sequence of the letter. But itâs about more than the letter. Itâs about the notion that we need to drastically change the way we run the planet and how to affect those changes. This episode and episode 48 with Ron Bailey function as counter-points to each other, so they can be listened to as a set.
| |||
| 13 Dec 2024 | 51. What's all this talk about biodiversity credits? (Harrison Carter) | 00:45:58 | |
From time to time certain concepts rise to prominence in biodiversity conservation circles, and some of these follow in the footsteps of climate change analogs. One such concept is biodiversity credits. Biodiversity credits are a mechanism that allow for biodiversity conservation or restoration activities to derive a revenue stream through the production and sale of a quantifiable unit of improvement in biodiversity. Despite the technical and philosophical challenges involved in trading in biodiversity credits, or even defining a single unit, biodiversity credits are being used to offset damages to biodiversity. And given the explosion of private and public interest in biodiversity credits, they are worthy of further exploration. Helping us to explore them is Harrison Carter, an interdisciplinary conservation scientist at the University of Oxfordâs Biology Department. Harrison has studied biodiversity credits in detail and shares his personal views on this complex topic. This is a fairly technical conversation, but non-conservationists should still find it interesting, and it gets easier as it goes along. We talk about the good and the bad around biodiversity credits, starting with a broad description of the concept.Â
| |||
| 13 Jan 2025 | 52. Whatâs all the fuss about the EU Nature Restoration Law? (Brian MacSharry) | 00:43:31 | |
Itâs not often that biodiversity legislation grabs international headlines, but thats what happened repeatedly in 2024 with the European Unionâs new Nature Restoration Law. It happened first because of the ambitious nature of the law; and then because of the political tussle around its rejection and eventual approval. Along the way it gathered a trail of detractors and supporters, and has raised hopes as well as concerns, depending on who you speak to. The lawâs overarching target is for Member States to put in place restoration measures in at least 20% of the EU's land areas and 20% of its sea areas by 2030. Brian MacSharry, who was also my guest for episode 10 on protected areas, is Head of the Nature and Biodiversity Group at the European Environment Agency and he has had a birds-eye view of the development of the law. He kindly agreed to respond to some of the critiques of the law, but first he goes into some detail about its content and its journey through the political process.
| |||
| 10 Feb 2025 | 53. Shouldn't we reframe environmental narratives? (Ragini Prasad) | 00:39:42 | |
Among most legacy media outlets and on social media, narratives about environmental issues, as well as social issues, are noticeably more extreme than they used to be. From activists to academics and from organizations to corporations, it has become common to hear phrases like âshattering Earth's natural limitsâ, âecological meltdownâ, and âboiling oceansâ. Much of this rhetoric comes from a place of genuine concern and it usually contains important elements of truth. But itâs also often emotive and inaccurate, and there is reason to believe that it could be causing more harm than good. Ragini Prasad, an environmental engineer turned coach for leaders and changemakers, has long challenged the apocalyptic narrative surrounding our environmental discourse. She wants to calm these conversations and empower individuals to rediscover their agency. In this episode, Ragini emphasizes the importance of openness to new perspectives and points out that every existential crisis presents an opportunity for individual and collective evolution. She advocates for organic changeâchange that naturally emerges when we align ourselves with principles of life, resilience, and hope. | |||
| 10 Mar 2025 | 54. What does Trump 2.0 mean for the environment? | 00:41:00 | |
Americaâs reelection of Donald Trump has brought about all manner of changes in US and global politics. Some have a direct effect on environmental issues while many more may be indirectly consequential. The media, it seems, has reacted mostly with horror and predictions of disaster, and there are probably any number of commentators willing to echo those sentiments on a podcast. It might be more interesting though, and perhaps more informative, to hear the voice of a less critical environmentalist. Quill Robinson is an Associate Fellow at the Center for Strategic & International Studies (CSIS), a Washington DC-based think tank, and Assistant Director of the institute's Energy Security and Climate Change Program. He was a guest on the podcast three years back and was kind enough to accept another invitation, to weigh in on this topic. | |||
| 15 Sep 2020 | Introduction to the case for conservation podcast (André Mader) | 00:06:39 | |
In this introduction I explain the purpose of the case for conservation podcast, and outline some basic concepts. I also describe the format that I will be using, and generally try to give the listener some idea of what to expect from subsequent episodes. In all of those subsequent episodes, I will be interviewing guests, and getting into specific topics. | |||
| 15 Sep 2020 | 1. Is the conservation message getting through? (Tim Hirsch) | 00:59:23 | |
This episode explores the question of whether the conservation message is "getting through" and, if not, why not? Communication of this message is necessary because governments, businesses, communities, organizations and individuals need to be aware, and inspired, in order to take action. My guest had some insightful, and surprisingly positive, perspectives on this issue. | |||
| 15 Sep 2020 | 2. What do we really know about the links between nature and COVID-19? (David Duthie) | 00:49:00 | |
This episode explores the links between nature and COVID-19, and between nature and zoonotic disease in general. We examine the common assertion that the degradation or destruction of ecosystems is a cause of pandemics, and not just correlated with them. David helps to alleviate some (but perhaps not all) of my concerns about the accuracy of the literature on this subject. | |||
| 04 Oct 2020 | 3. Are we getting conservation right in developing countries? (Mao Amis) | 00:43:29 | |
Ongoing biodiversity loss is most severe in the developing world, but the funding for conservation comes mostly from the developed world. In the past, conservation notoriously ignored the needs of local people. Times have changed, but how well are conservation initiatives working for people and for nature in the developing world now? | |||
| 10 Nov 2020 | 4. Who'd want to choose conservation as a career? (Nick Askew) | 00:49:57 | |
The conservation of nature and biodiversity is often considered to be a labor of love. After all, why would anyone want to dedicate their career to such a daunting task, which is not known for its moneymaking potential? In the developing world especially, as explained by a previous guest, more lucrative jobs are pursued as a way out of poverty. And yet we need conservationists of all stripes to tackle the biodiversity crisis. | |||
| 01 Dec 2020 | 5. Is nature conservation being too conservative? (Michelle Marvier) | 00:40:55 | |
Uncertainty of outcomes is a feature of conservation. That's perhaps why the "precautionary principle" is held so sacred in this field. But, considering the potential cost of inaction in a rapidly-changing world, are we being a bit too cautious? Michelle Marvier and Peter Kereiva recently tackled this topic, and Michelle discussed it with me on the podcast. | |||
| 01 Jan 2021 | 6. Why should cities play a bigger role in conservation? (Debra Roberts) | 00:48:17 | |
Since about 2007 most of the world's population has been living in cities and, if there's one thing we're learning about conservation, it's that people matter. But why do people in cities matter? Why do cities themselves matter? And why are cities not playing a more prominent role in conservation globally? Â I ask Debra Roberts, whose experience and skills range from academia to policy to implementation; across local, national and international levels; and in both biodiversity conservation and climate change action. Among many accolades, Debra was recently named one of Apolitico's 100 most influential people in climate policy, alongside the likes of Al Gore and David Attenborough. Despite a high profile at the international level, she continues a long career primarily dedicated to the sustainability of her home city, Durban (eThekwini) in South Africa. | |||
| 31 Jan 2021 | 7. Are alien species always a net negative? (Martin Schlaepfer) | 00:50:46 | |
Invasive alien species are considered one of the five main direct drivers of biodiversity loss, worldwide, as well as causing untold damage to economic assets like agriculture. Is there ever anything to be said for accepting them into the landscapes or seascapes they've occupied? And what about non-invasive alien species, and invasive native species? Martin Schlaepfer is an ecologist and senior lecturer at the University of Geneva. He has diverse experience across the field of conservation biology in North America and Europe. Links to resources can be found at www.case4conservation.com | |||
| 01 Mar 2021 | 8. How can indigenous & local knowledge complement biodiversity science? (Zsolt MolnĂĄr) | 00:47:16 | |
Indigenous peoples and local communities are increasingly recognized for the importance of their contribution to global biodiversity knowledge. But is indigenous & local knowledge (ILK) being vetted, in a parallel to peer review's vetting of scientific knowledge? And how does ILK add to global biodiversity knowledge, if it is typically very localized? | |||
| 05 Apr 2021 | 9. Is there still racial discrimination in conservation? (Gillian Burke) | 00:55:14 | |
Many Western nations have been undergoing a period of intense reflection on issues of discrimination. Recent incidents have re-ignited social movements like Black Lives Matter. Public intellectuals are addressing the topic with a variety of opinions - often confined to their own echo chambers. Are all concerns about discrimination justified? Are people too easily assuming that discrimination is the reason for injustice? And... what on Earth does any of this have to do with conservation? | |||
| 02 May 2021 | 10. How's it going with protected areas? (Brian MacSharry) | 00:54:17 | |
Protected areas like nature reserves and national parks are about the most fundamental manifestation of nature conservation there is, and have existed in various forms for centuries. But are they achieving what they are meant to achieve? Does formal protection necessarily translate into biodiversity conserved? | |||
| 07 Jun 2021 | 11. Performative conservation: What's wrong with showing off? (Adam Welz) | 00:51:41 | |
These days some very impressive-sounding conservation projects are catching the public eye, from massive tree-planting initiatives to high-profile urban greening. They capture the headlines and they capture the imagination. But do they deserve the level of attention and adulation that they receive? Or should we be a little more discerning as conservationists and the public, and pay a little more attention to the details? Someone who has looked into these questions is Adam Welz. He is a writer, photographer, filmmaker and self-proclaimed conservation theorist with an uncompromising approach to conservation. 04:25: What does it mean to be a conservation theorist? | |||
| 05 Jul 2021 | 12. Is hype distorting science? (Randy Schekman) | 00:48:06 | |
The scientific method remains the best systematic approach we have been able to develop in our ongoing endeavor to advance human flourishing. But that does not mean it's perfect - indeed, it probably never will be. But what are the ways in which we can make science better? Perhaps some of the most fundamental ways lie in the process of publishing research findings. This applies to biodiversity science as much as it does to other scientific disciplines. Randy Schekman joins me to pick apart some of the well-known and less well-known critiques of the scientific publication process, including the role of hype. Randy is a cell biologist, Nobel Prize winner, and previous editor-in-chief of PNAS, Annual Review of Cell Developmental Biology, and eLife. He is based at the University of California, Berkeley, where he has spent almost his entire career. | |||
| 02 Aug 2021 | 13. Does biodiversity prevent pandemics? (Dan Salkeld) | 00:40:13 | |
There is a lot in the media these days about how protecting biodiversity reduces the risk of zoonotic disease spillover, and hence the risk of epidemics and pandemics. There seems to be a lot of good evidence for this in published studies on the topic, but how universal is such a conclusion? What is the science behind it? What about context? Are there exceptions to the rule? Dan Salkeld is a disease ecologist, and professor at Colorado State University. He has been addressing this topic in the literature for years, and shares some of his conclusions with us. We also talk a little more broadly about the trend, in the literature, towards making generic causal links, when the sum of the data show correlations of varying strength, and include exceptions. | |||
| 06 Sep 2021 | 14. How do conservationists keep going? (Widar Narvelo & Grant Pearsell) | 00:46:54 | |
Most conservationists are motivated by the purpose of their work. But that work often involves a lot of struggle and it can be daunting, especially when one does not yet have the experience of hard-won success to draw inspiration from. So, how do we keep going when the odds seem stacked against us? | |||
| 04 Oct 2021 | 15. Is conservatism better for conservation? (Quill Robinson) | 00:44:00 | |
Why has environmentalism come to be considered a left-wing agenda, even though much of its history has conservative roots? And what does it even mean to be conservative when it comes to conservation and environmental issues? Quill Robinson has some ideas about this. He is Vice President of Government Affairs for the American Conservation Coalition, and spends much of his time in Congress advocating for what he considers pragmatic, bipartisan policy solutions to environmental challenges. He turned conservative after witnessing the defeat of one such policy solution by progressive organizations early in his career. | |||
| 01 Nov 2021 | 16. How do we cultivate enthusiasm for nature? (Steven Lowe) | 00:45:44 | |
People from various walks of life have an affinity to nature. Why is that, and why is nature important to us? This episode is less of an inquiry and more of a ramble through this topic, with one of the most nature-loving, inspiring and interesting people I know. Steven Lowe is is a high school science teacher in the UK. But he started as a cardiovascular cell biology researcher, after earning his PhD in that subject. In between those two sub-careers he spent more than 10 years studying and working in conservation biology - mostly in South Africa - where we met doing our Masters degrees in that subject. | |||
| 05 Dec 2021 | 17. Are we conserving for the right reasons? (Sharachchandra Lele) | 00:53:43 | |
Much has been written about why we wish to protect nature. The initial motivation for conservation was ostensibly for nature's own sake. Around the 1980s, the concept of ecosystem services began to highlight ways in which we depend on nature, as a motivation for conservation. Ecosystem services and similar concepts now dominate the discourse. But do they adequately describe our relationship with nature? Sharachchandra Lele (or Sharad, for short) is Distinguished Fellow in Environmental Policy & Governance at the Ashoka Trust for Research in Ecology & the Environment (ATREE) in Bangalore. After starting his career as an engineer, he went on to earn a PhD in Energy & Resources at UC Berkeley. Since then he has held positions as Senior Research Associate at the Pacific Institute, and fellowships or visiting fellowships at Harvard, Stanford and Cambridge Universities.
02:46: Sharad's career change, from engineering to conservation and related topics | |||
| 03 Jan 2022 | 18. Can we balance people's and nature's water needs? (Jenny Day) | 00:38:23 | |
Freshwater biodiversity tends to be the most threatened of all types of biodiversity. In this episode I speak with Jenny Day about the state of freshwater biodiversity in South Africa's drought-prone Southwestern Cape, and elsewhere in the world. We get into how it coexists with humankindâs need for water. Jenny is emeritus professor of freshwater ecology at the University of Cape Town, where she was also Director of the Freshwater Research Unit for many years. She has co-authored the book Vanishing Waters and, more recently, Freshwater Life: A field guide to the plants and animals of southern Africa, as well as numerous papers and research reports on various aspects of river and wetland ecology. | |||